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Top of Mind: Caroline Wagner

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Professor Caroline Wagner’s expertise in international science and technology research and policy has earned her global respect. (Credit: Majesti Brown)

Caroline Wagner has spent her career helping policymakers better understand how science and technology systems operate so they can govern them and influence them in a positive way.

Wagner, who retired this spring and is now a Faculty Emeritus of the Glenn College, said policymakers need to understand that science and technology operate similarly to a garden that grows with uncertainty.

“Science and technology systems operate very differently than how we think about organizing, for example, a health care system or education system constructed from the top down. Science and technology are like the opposite of that. Because it’s research, you don’t know what you’re trying to create or going to produce. You can only create the conditions in which it flourishes,” Wagner said. “It’s always because of the garden concept of science that it’s very hard for policymakers to understand it, because they want to control it and have certain outcomes.”

That’s where I operated: between the policymakers’ desire of, ‘Can’t we just structure this so it does what we need it to do?’ and understanding the nature of how it just flourishes. That’s been to me the most interesting part of my work.

Caroline Wagner
Glenn College Faculty Emeritus

Her expertise in science and technology research and policy, along with the related international aspects, has earned her global respect. 

“Caroline’s understanding of science as a global, networked enterprise and the need to map its linkages has been remarkable,” said Paul Dufour, Senior Fellow at the University of Ottawa’s Institute for Science, Society and Policy, who has collaborated with Wagner on global science cooperation research. “Her sociological perspectives, backed up with scientometrics and related data sets on why these linkages matter to society, security, sovereignty and the future of the planet, remain unparalleled.”

A distinguished Fellow of the American Association for the Advancement of Science and a former elected member of the Council on Foreign Relations, Wagner joined Ohio State in 2011 after serving as a policy analyst working with and for government in a career that spanned more than 30 years and three continents. 

 

Caroline Wagner, right, talks to visitors at the Battelle Center for Science and Technology Policy during an open house welcoming her as its new director in 2011.

At the Glenn College, she engaged with students at all levels, from a freshman seminar on the history of space to doctoral students in public policy analysis. Her favorite class was Leadership in Public and Nonprofit Sectors, where she taught and guided the future leaders of our nation by bringing her own experience working in science and technology roles with the White House and the U.S. Congress into the classroom. She was director of the Battelle Center for Science, Engineering and Public Policy, a research center within the Glenn College, from 2011 to 2015.

Her expertise led to her selection for the Expert Panel on International Science, Technology, Innovation and Knowledge Partnerships for the Council of Canadian Academies on a report called “Navigating Collaborative Futures.” The 2024 assessment examined best practices and identified key elements of a rigorous, data-enabled approach to selecting international science, technology and innovation. 

“This extensive examination of Canada’s strategic global partnerships in science and technology offered the Canadian government (and others) a timely assessment of emerging trends and strategies to engage with international researchers,” Dufour said. “Indeed, as Caroline pointed out to the panel, where once just seven nations produced 90% of all new scholarship, today that 90% includes more than a dozen countries. This includes the so-called BRICS that have increased their own national research capacities,” BRICS, comprising Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, United Arab Emirates, Ethiopia, Indonesia and Iran, serves as a political and diplomatic coordination forum for countries from the Global South and for coordination in the most diverse areas. 

“And, as Caroline reminded, strategic and thoughtful choices must be made to take advantage of the opportunities for national welfare and to contribute meaningfully to the global public good,” Dufour said.

Professor Caroline Wagner gives a 2018 talk on the importance of openness in international collaboration among scientists as part of Masterminds, a series of short, engaging talks made by brilliant faculty at Ohio State. (Credit: Logan Wallace)

What does she consider her greatest academic accomplishment? Discovering a way to measure and explain why international collaboration was growing the way it was. The findings, shared in a 2005 article that remains the most highly cited of her publications, showed that at the international level, researchers connect based on desire for attachment to reputation.

“In other words, when you connect with somebody at a distance, you’re connecting because they present to you a greater ability to get attention,” she explained. “Maybe that person is more famous or has more data that you really need. The system operates on a dynamic of reputation.” 

The more elite the scientist, the more likely it is they’re connected at the international level.

Caroline Wagner
Glenn College Faculty Emeritus

“The research looked from around 1980 when we began to see a mini explosion of international collaborations. It was supercharged when the Soviet Union fell and countries were free from constraints they had in the past. All these people were joining and bringing a lot of smarts. You had this incredible golden age of science,” Wagner said, pointing out the dynamic growth at the time in nanomaterials, genetics, vaccine development, quantum computing and technology, and astrophysics, all of which came from international collaborations. 

Even in retirement, she plans to continue following her passions in international science and technology policy. She serves on the Societal Impacts of Science and Technology committee of the American Association for the Advancement of Science. She was recently tapped as the leader of the evaluation team for the new NSF-backed center, Safeguarding the Entire Community of the U.S. Research Ecosystem (SECURE). She serves on the International Working Group for the National Science Foundation’s Research on Research Security program and, with the National Academy of Sciences, the Subcommittee on U.S.-China Scientific Engagement.

“Looking back, I’ve had the most amazing career,” Wagner said. “I’ve been incredibly lucky to have done the work I’ve done. I’m filled with gratitude about everything.”

She shares some memories about her prestigious career.

What prompted your interest in science and technology policy?

In college I majored in religion and philosophy. You’d think that didn’t make much sense compared to where I ended up. But it does make sense. I was always interested in how society names its values and implements them. How do we make decisions about what’s good or bad and right or wrong? When I finished my undergraduate degree, I realized I probably wasn’t going to get a job in religion, so I thought, “Where in society do we name our values?” The more I looked into it, it seemed like public policy is where we state our values. That is how I came to study policy. Then, regarding science and technology, it was the same question: How do we know our place in the universe? They ask that in religion, but they also do that in science. 

What challenges are facing the field of science and technology, its relationship to policy, society and innovation, and international collaboration?

The challenges are quite significant right now because there is a push toward scientific nationalism and a push toward research security that really has not been a major theme of science and technology in the last 40 years. Before that, we saw scientific nationalism, especially in WWII with the development of the atomic bomb and biological weapons. After WWII, we came to recognize the benefits in sharing knowledge. The more knowledge you get, the more you develop new knowledge. We came into a period of exponential growth in science output and international collaboration. I studied that a lot: Why did international science grow the way it did and create the benefits it did? In the last decade or so I also turned to study China. China comes into the scientific system in a way no other nation has been able to. They took advantage that we had an open system for them to learn. They did that and they added a lot. But they break some of the “rules” of what we thought guided nations into the system. So that got me interested in how they were doing it and how that was affecting U.S. and international collaboration. 

Now we see much more of a political layer on top of science. Before, if you wanted to work with other countries, it was fine. Now we’re adding a political overlay on top because of the different political systems between us and China. A lot of people feel very uncomfortable with China being a science leader given its authoritarian dictatorship. Now we have a growing field of research conducted on research security.

Professor Caroline Wagner teaches a class in 2023. (Credit: Majesti Brown)

How would you describe your teaching style?

First of all, I always wanted students to feel that they could make a contribution. When I was young, I always thought, “Where do I fit in the world?” I want students to know the world does need your passion and your smarts. You need to be as educated and skilled as you can possibly be in order to make that contribution. That was very important to me as a teacher to infuse in them that they should not just be passionate about things, but they shouldn’t be shy about seeking to make that contribution. 

Leadership from Volunteerism to the Statehouse

Two-time Glenn College graduate Christine Cockley, an Ohio House representative, shares leadership lessons she learned from Faculty Emeritus Caroline Wagner.

Then, it goes back to reasons why I did what I did in my career. I felt it was important for students to understand that our whole society is based on some basic principles, and those principles for us are built into the Constitution and Bill of Rights. We’re not just making things up as we go; we have standards — that’s the way we create order and social benefit. I also reintroduced the Constitution in my classes. I would make students memorize the Preamble to the Constitution. These are the basic principles on which we base our decision making. That was always really, really important to me as a teacher.

What did you enjoy most about your time at the Glenn College?

I just think the Glenn College is the most collegial environment you could hope to have. I’ve talked to academics in other places; we have something special at the Glenn College. At the base of that collegiality is that the college is extremely well-run and well-staffed. In a way, staff seem quiet and marginal, but they create the support system in which you work. The staff has been a little unsung in terms of their heroics of how they support the work we do at the Glenn College. I’m grateful for my colleagues and staff and the university as a whole in how it supports scholarship and teaching.

Do you have a funny or touching memory you could share about your time here?

I was in the building with my daughter, who at the time was a middle school student, and we met Sen. John and Annie Glenn on their way out the door. So I wanted to introduce them to my daughter. John said to her, “What are you studying at school?” She told him what she was studying but said science and math were really hard. He said to her, “They’re supposed to be hard, and that’s why you tackle them.” I thought, what a gift to have the great man take few moments to talk to my daughter and tell her it’s supposed to be hard. It was an incredibly touching moment. She went on to graduate with highest honors in psychology and now is going to grad school in psychology. I hope she took to heart that it’s supposed to be hard.

Read a former student’s and fellow researcher’s memories about Wagner.

Travis Whetsell earned his PhD in public policy and management at the then-John Glenn School of Public Affairs in 2017.

Professor Wagner was my dissertation advisor in the mid-2010s. I remember I first got to know her because she sent out an open invitation to all the graduate students in the John Glenn School of Public Affairs (not yet a college) asking if we were interested in a co-authorship opportunity working on a manuscript she had been developing around science policy. As a grad student, you are generally looking for ways to publish. I had no knowledge or experience in science policy, bibliometrics or network analysis. In fact, at the time, my focus was on the philosophy of public administration. I had never and still have never heard of a professor being so open to collaborating with students that they send out blanket invitations like this. I would later learn that this fit perfectly with the ideals of open science, which she both preached and practiced. Responding to the invitation turned out to be a great instinct, because it marked the start of my career as a science policy researcher. Now I am a professor at the Jimmy and Rosalynn Carter School of Public Policy at Georgia Tech, which is considered one of the top science policy schools in the world.

Paul Dufour, Senior Fellow at the University of Ottawa’s Institute for Science, Society and Policy, has collaborated with Wagner on global science cooperation research.

Over several decades now, I have had the privilege of being Caroline’s friend and colleague. She is a wonderful collaborator with her thoughtful, articulate and well-documented contributions to the research on global science cooperation. I have also had the opportunity to work with her and offer commentary on some of this literature, as well as assisting in linking her to my own network. We first connected when I was with Canada’s International Development Research Centre and Caroline was looking for contacts in the developing world, and our collaboration only grew from there. Caroline knows Canada well and has given several talks at conferences in Canada over the years, and she kindly asked me to join her advisory board when she was heading up the Battelle Center for Science, Engineering and Public Policy.

Of course, her classic 2008 Brookings book, “The New Invisible College: Science for Development,” is required reading for anyone trying to grasp the intricacies of science collaboration among researchers around the globe. This oeuvre, with a forward by Francis Fukuyama, telegraphed the emerging scale and scope of knowledge production and anticipated the rise of new players beyond the usual suspects. By its very nature, science is power and its ability to transcend geopolitical strife and assist in diplomacy can be very effective. And, it should not be forgotten, science is also a global public good. Today, we need this even more.

Long ago, Caroline warned that the U.S. would not and could not continue to be the major player in science and noted that the rise of other players — especially China — would change the knowledge network dynamics. I am always learning from her. 

Caroline has also been a great contributor to Canada’s efforts in research partnerships. I offered some guidance to Caroline when she was developing the 1999 RAND report on “U.S. Government Funding of Cooperative Research and Development in North America,” a document that offered up some salient data and commentary on how Canada and the U.S. were strong partners for progress. More recently, in 2024, we were both members of the Council of Canadian Academies Expert Panel on International Science, Technology and Knowledge Partnerships that led to the report “Navigating Collaborative Futures.”

Caroline is surely highly deserving of Emeritus status to continue her groundbreaking research at Ohio State. She remains my great friend and is, dare I say, a true friend of Canada.